unknown on sheep dung - Forum ASCOFrance

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unknown on sheep dung

Sven Heinz, 02-02-2018 19:01

Hello together,

does anyone know this mushroom? I found it on sheep dung.
Fruitbody: 200 x 150 µ
Asci: 40 x 6 µ, uniseriat, no iodine reaktion
Spores: 5 - 6 x 3 µ
Hairs: 25 x 2 - 3 µ, not septet, it looks like an arrow

Greetings Sven

Michel Delpont, 03-02-2018 09:42

Re : unknown on sheep dung

Hello Sven.

Interesting find. It is not clear whether the spores might have an envelope; also, would you have observed another pore (or many) as opposed to the germ pore.

Michel.

Sven Heinz, 03-02-2018 16:02

Re : unknown on sheep dung

Hello,

I have examined another fungus. The spores have no shell and two pores.

Greetings Sven

Michel Delpont, 03-02-2018 18:03

Re : unknown on sheep dung

It seemed to me to have detected two pores on the spores. Your last two photos as well as the orientation of the spores in the asci, but also the lack of envelope could point to the genres Periamphispora and Fimetariella? How are the perithecia distributed, did you notice the presence of a subiculum?

Michel.

Sven Heinz, 03-02-2018 18:17

Re : unknown on sheep dung

Yes, the spores have two pores. The perithecia grow loosely and individually on the surface and have no subiculum.

Greetings Sven

Norbert Heine, 05-02-2018 12:18

Re : unknown on sheep dung

No, Michel,

this is neither a Fimetariella (smallest species is F. microsperma with spores 12-14 x 7-9) nor Periamphispora phacelodes (spores much larger).

I think you should compare with "Sordaria minima", Sven!
The size and form of the spores are identical with those of "S. minima".
This species stands nearly to Melanospora and is parasitic on Thelebolus. Maybe that you did find some Thelebolus spec. on the sheep dung too?
I'm not sure, that the "hairs" belongs to the species and I don't believe, that there are two germpores. But this feature is not easy to see.

We discussed the problem im Pilzforum.eu some time ago.
Follow also my answer (#4).
https://www.pilzforum.eu/board/thema-kleiner-unbekannter-auf-rehdung

Best wishes, Norbert

Michel Delpont, 05-02-2018 14:46

Re : unknown on sheep dung

Hello Norbert!

Absolutely, my thoughts were only research hypotheses for Sven (spores do not fit for these genres!); indeed, you're right, I had not thought of "S.Minima" (despite the small size of the spores) that I found only twice and the presence of hair disturbed me a little. It is always beneficial to resume work on rare species.

Best wishes

Michel.

Peter Püwert, 05-02-2018 16:25

Re : unknown on sheep dung

Hi Michel,
the hair has also disturbed me. Meanwhile, I believe that these vegetable components are, Verbascum and similar species have so similar elements.
Greetings Peter.

Sven Heinz, 05-02-2018 19:04

Re : unknown on sheep dung

Hello together,

thank you for your efforts. But some things are strange to me. I have found no Thelebolus but only Saccobolus and Schizothecium. There are hairs on every mushroom. Besides, I have just sporadically found spores with a pedicel. Realy very strange!

Greetings Sven

Norbert Heine, 05-02-2018 19:38

Re : unknown on sheep dung

Very interesting discussion, Sven!

Sordaria minima was an idea, but surely not the best ;-(
Your last photos show that there are a lot of hairs, which belong to this species.

Now I remember to a species we discussed two years ago.

It is Melanospora aculeata E.C.Hansen, a species with two germpores and short hairs!

Look here.

https://www.pilzforum.eu/board/thread/32467-und-noch-was-mit-seten-stacheln/

I don't know what else it should be.

Norbert

Sven Heinz, 05-02-2018 20:58

Re : unknown on sheep dung

Thank you Norbert, that's the mushroom!

Sven.

Peter Püwert, 26-11-2018 13:58

Re : unknown on sheep dung

Now I have also found the hairy " Sordaria minima ", associated with Thelebolus stercoreus on deer dung. In the same collection perithecies are also without these "hairs", some also only with few. All measures correspond to those in the literature and the net found out, also in DOVERI 2004. The assumption lies near, that Doveri and others, I too, had so far overlooked these hairs and determind the fungus as „Sordaria" minima sensu DOVERI 2004 or ELLIS and ELLIS 1998.
Fruitbody: globos to subglobos, 50 – 100 µm
Hairs: - max. 25 µm long
Asci: 35-38 x 6-7 µm

Spores: 5-6 x 3-3,5 µm

Greetings Peter.