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Une hélotiale sur Sphagnum palustre
Michel Hairaud,
14-07-2025 11:20
Bonjour, Voici une espèce de (?) Hyaloscyphaceae rencontrée plusieurs fois sur des sphaignes. Ici Sphagnum palustre et en mélange avec Bryoscyphus tetrasporus (nom provisoire) :
Asques 60-75 x 7-8 , avec crochets, IKI BB Calycina type. P. S. 35-38
Spores (12) 15-20 x 2,8-3 µm , cylindro-clavées , OCI 1-2 de petites guttules plutôt répartiées aux pôles. Non septées.
Paraphyses sans vacuoles réfringentes, x 2 µm.
Esctal prismatique
Poils de marge jusqu'à 120 µm de long, se terminant en pointe, septés, hyalins
Ma première hypothèse est une espèce du genre Hyaloscypha mais les spores seraient alors vraiment particulières.
La présence non constante d'un subiculum léger m'a aussi fait considérer la famille Arachnopezizaceae mais sopres non septées.
Je n'ai pas de certitude sur le caractère infectieux du champignon qui apparait aussi bien sur les mousses bien vertes contrairement au Bryoscyphus tetrasporus récolté sur les mêmes sphaignes.
Merci de toute aide possible
AmitiésMichel
Hans-Otto Baral,
14-07-2025 11:33
Re : Une hélotiale sur Sphagnum palustre
Hi Michel
did you compare Arachnopeziza sphagniseda? I have a folder for this.
Zotto
Michel Hairaud,
14-07-2025 20:56
Re : Une hélotiale sur Sphagnum palustre
Thanks, Zotto, I had totally overlooked that species !!
There are some differences but my collections are obviously close
The main difference is the the total lacking of spore septation. And also spore and asci size but mt values are on living material. I show pics of another collection with hyphae infecting the moss and spores of the first collection (MH 10916) also in Brittany in a Salix marsh
Michel
There are some differences but my collections are obviously close
The main difference is the the total lacking of spore septation. And also spore and asci size but mt values are on living material. I show pics of another collection with hyphae infecting the moss and spores of the first collection (MH 10916) also in Brittany in a Salix marsh
Michel
Hans-Otto Baral,
14-07-2025 22:20
Re : Une hélotiale sur Sphagnum palustre
Michel, I would be happy to attach the date and MH number to the collection. The last two pics are MH 10916 and what about the other?
Spore septation may actually occur inside the living asci (HB 3559, 9517) but not necessarily. My two folders atre probably the same species.
Michel Hairaud,
14-07-2025 22:32
Re : Une hélotiale sur Sphagnum palustre
MH 180625 . Sphagnum palustre. Brittany, Cotes d'Armor, Plounérin Réserve Naturelle Régionale . 28 06 2025
Hans-Otto Baral,
15-07-2025 08:06
Re : Une hélotiale sur Sphagnum palustre
MH 180625 28 06 2025 belongs to the first pics (spores (12) 15-20 x 2,8-3 µm)?
And the second pics with spores 16-19 x 3-3.2 belong to what?
Michel Hairaud,
15-07-2025 09:18
Re : Une hélotiale sur Sphagnum palustre
MH 10916 Sphagnum sp. Brittany , Cotes d'Armor, Belle-Isle-En-Terre , tourbière de la forête de Coat An Noz . 1 09 2016
Kosonen Timo,
16-07-2025 08:10
Re : Une hélotiale sur Sphagnum palustre
Salut!
Peut-etre Arachnopeziza estonica? A. sphagniseda sans poils. cf. Kosonen et al (2021).
t. Timo
Peut-etre Arachnopeziza estonica? A. sphagniseda sans poils. cf. Kosonen et al (2021).
t. Timo
Michel Hairaud,
16-07-2025 10:00
Re : Une hélotiale sur Sphagnum palustre
Salut Timo,
Thanks for your remarks . several elements in your description would match my collections : long tapering hairs , most (?) spores aseptate , at least in asci as shown in your plate , also resin droplets on hairs as shown in the below picture.
Asci and spores values are nevertherless shorter
Michel
Thanks for your remarks . several elements in your description would match my collections : long tapering hairs , most (?) spores aseptate , at least in asci as shown in your plate , also resin droplets on hairs as shown in the below picture.
Asci and spores values are nevertherless shorter
Michel
Hans-Otto Baral,
16-07-2025 10:27
Re : Une hélotiale sur Sphagnum palustre
The issue of spore septation strongly depends on vital study. For Timo's drawn asci this is not clear, but it seems to me that the right ascus was alive because of the short p. sporif. and oblique spore arrangement.
In Timo's drawing of sphagniseda the spores in the asci are also without septum.
Regarding hairs: Stip's SBRH719 has hairs. I have a note that he sent it to Seppo for sequencing. It was from June 2012. In Timo's work I cannot find the number 719.
Kosonen Timo,
16-07-2025 11:04
Re : Une hélotiale sur Sphagnum palustre
Vital characteristics for the Sphagnum related species are not complete; the study was mainly based on herbarium material and/or (incomplete) sketch from fresh material. The Stip's sample I do not recall, that was news to me. I need to recheck collections if it there.
Timo
Timo
Stip Helleman,
16-07-2025 23:15
Re : Une hélotiale sur Sphagnum palustre
There is no need for recheckin, I did and the collection is still here althoug I have noted "Turku" in my list. No Idea what happened but the intention was there. It is a different species, shorter spores and hairs, now it looks more Hyaloscypha-like to me.
Timo if you want the collection I can send you.
Stip
Kosonen Timo,
17-07-2025 10:18
Re : Une hélotiale sur Sphagnum palustre
Interesting. Smaller spores yes, but the asci (shape) and multiseptate hairs - I wouldnt exclude Arachnopeziza. Could be one of those non Hyaloscypha Hyaloscyphaceae s. str. :-) ...although I think very little if any collections are from bryophytes. If there are apos to be exctracted & studied I am interested!
Timo
Timo
Elisabeth Stöckli,
20-07-2025 11:10
Re : Une hélotiale sur Sphagnum palustre
Bonjour,
Ci-joint quelques photos d'une récolte sur Sphagnum palustre du Jura Suisse (au bord d'une tourbière à 1'015m), Apothécies 1.5 mm de diamètre, de couleur blanche, sessile, Asques 60 - 80 x 8 - 11 µm, avec crochets, IKI+, Spores 11 - 15 (17) x 2.5 - 3.25 µm, septées à l'âge, Paraphyses sans vacuoles réfringentes, pas de poils à la marge.
Pourrait-il s'agir d'A. sphagiseda? Merci pour vos avis.
Elisabeth
Ci-joint quelques photos d'une récolte sur Sphagnum palustre du Jura Suisse (au bord d'une tourbière à 1'015m), Apothécies 1.5 mm de diamètre, de couleur blanche, sessile, Asques 60 - 80 x 8 - 11 µm, avec crochets, IKI+, Spores 11 - 15 (17) x 2.5 - 3.25 µm, septées à l'âge, Paraphyses sans vacuoles réfringentes, pas de poils à la marge.
Pourrait-il s'agir d'A. sphagiseda? Merci pour vos avis.
Elisabeth
