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Unknown on cow dung
Maria Plekkenpol,
29-05-2020 11:28
Hello, on cowdung I saw these whitish asco's. Following Ellis + Ellis I end up at Coprotus, but I can't find one that matches the measures I have.Coprotus because of the fact that there is no bluestaining (J-), at least: as far as I see?? Apothecia max 1 mm. Asci clavate to broadly clavate, operculate, Croziers+. 80-120 x 13-23, 8-spored. Spores ellipsoid, hyaline, smooth, 14-16,5 x 8-9. I hope someone can help, I'm probably looking in the wrong direction here.... Thank you!
Michel Delpont,
29-05-2020 11:54
Re : Unknown on cow dung
Hello Maria !
You are in the right direction, compare with Coprotus disculus!
Michel.
Maria Plekkenpol,
29-05-2020 14:04
Re : Unknown on cow dung
Hello Michel,
Thank you very much!!!
Maria
Thank you very much!!!
Maria
Maria Plekkenpol,
29-05-2020 19:08
Re : Unknown on cow dung
Hello Michel,
I looked at it and read two articles (Coprotus (Thelebolaceae, Thelebolales) in herbivore dung
from Brazil, Roger Fagner Ribeiro Melo, Andrew Nicholas Miller and Leonor Costa Maia and North American species of Coprotus (Thelebolaceae : Pezizales), JAMES W. KIMBROUGH, E. R. LUCK-ALLEN, AND ROY F. CAIN.
In both is described that C. leucopocillum differs from C. disculus, amongst other things in size and form of the asci en size of the spores. These measures do differ quite a bit, so my question is: is it possible, seeing the quite longer asci AND spores, to think of C. leucopcillum or are there grounds to say it's C. disculus??
Thank you, Maria
I looked at it and read two articles (Coprotus (Thelebolaceae, Thelebolales) in herbivore dung
from Brazil, Roger Fagner Ribeiro Melo, Andrew Nicholas Miller and Leonor Costa Maia and North American species of Coprotus (Thelebolaceae : Pezizales), JAMES W. KIMBROUGH, E. R. LUCK-ALLEN, AND ROY F. CAIN.
In both is described that C. leucopocillum differs from C. disculus, amongst other things in size and form of the asci en size of the spores. These measures do differ quite a bit, so my question is: is it possible, seeing the quite longer asci AND spores, to think of C. leucopcillum or are there grounds to say it's C. disculus??
Thank you, Maria
Michel Delpont,
29-05-2020 20:18
Re : Unknown on cow dung
Yes, I answered a little quickly, I was not thinking of disculus but of leucopocillum. Your photos and measurements are correct.
Michel.
Maria Plekkenpol,
29-05-2020 20:56
Re : Unknown on cow dung
Hello Michel,
Thank you for your reaction!! I also really want to say that these fast reactions (and I realise that that is not always possible) from you, Ingo, Zotto and others are very motivating for me. I am very passionate, but also work fulltime and there are so many variables to consider: it's not easy. So your help motivates and stimulates and helps me a lot: very much appreciated!
I add one other picture: you have seen this al lot of times I presume, but these are my first De Bary bubbles :) :)Â
Maria
Thank you for your reaction!! I also really want to say that these fast reactions (and I realise that that is not always possible) from you, Ingo, Zotto and others are very motivating for me. I am very passionate, but also work fulltime and there are so many variables to consider: it's not easy. So your help motivates and stimulates and helps me a lot: very much appreciated!
I add one other picture: you have seen this al lot of times I presume, but these are my first De Bary bubbles :) :)Â
Maria
Norbert Heine,
30-05-2020 17:04
Re : Unknown on cow dung
Hello Maria,
also in my opinion that agrees very well with Coprotus leucopocillum!
It seems to be a common species, for example I had more than 30 finds in the last years. More than half of it on cow dung!
Nice picture of the De Bary bubbles, which you will see only on dead spores, I think!
Norbert
Maria Plekkenpol,
30-05-2020 23:05
Re : Unknown on cow dung
Hello Norbert,
Thank you for your reply. Good to hear that you have found this species a lot: now knowing where and when to look for it I hope I will also see them more!!!
As for the de Bary bubbles: thank you for the compliment :). I have been searching articles about it, but what I read is about living ascospores... ??Â
"Cotton blue in lactic acid (CB) has only been tested for its effects on ripe ascospores with non-elastic walls developing de Bary bubbles artifact." (Coprotus arduennensis, a new species of
coprophilousdiscomycetes (Pezizales, Ascomycot, Persoonia 2002)
"... prolate, smooth (under transmission light microscope), eguttulate ascospores in all developmental stages sporoplasm of which have strong affinities to form de Bary bubble in any anhydrous conditions (especially in media such Cotton Blue)... " (Coprotus Korf & Kimbr., American Journal of Botany 54(1): 21, 1967.)
I couldn't find anything about the spores having to be dead?? Or do you mean dead because of of the fact that chemicals have to be added to see them?
Maria
Thank you for your reply. Good to hear that you have found this species a lot: now knowing where and when to look for it I hope I will also see them more!!!
As for the de Bary bubbles: thank you for the compliment :). I have been searching articles about it, but what I read is about living ascospores... ??Â
"Cotton blue in lactic acid (CB) has only been tested for its effects on ripe ascospores with non-elastic walls developing de Bary bubbles artifact." (Coprotus arduennensis, a new species of
coprophilousdiscomycetes (Pezizales, Ascomycot, Persoonia 2002)
"... prolate, smooth (under transmission light microscope), eguttulate ascospores in all developmental stages sporoplasm of which have strong affinities to form de Bary bubble in any anhydrous conditions (especially in media such Cotton Blue)... " (Coprotus Korf & Kimbr., American Journal of Botany 54(1): 21, 1967.)
I couldn't find anything about the spores having to be dead?? Or do you mean dead because of of the fact that chemicals have to be added to see them?
Maria
Norbert Heine,
31-05-2020 15:31
Re : Unknown on cow dung
"Or do you mean dead because of of the fact that chemicals have to be added to see them?"
Yes, that's what I mean.
Norbert
Maria Plekkenpol,
01-06-2020 14:39
Re : Unknown on cow dung
Thank you Norbert!
Maria
Maria