17-03-2012 08:52
Christiane Baethcke
Hallo everybody,I found this species on alpaca dun
07-03-2012 12:13
Savic DragisaHi everyone,I know for this forum for some time bu
25-03-2012 19:03
Björn Wergen
Hiyesterday I have found a completely immersed pyr
12-03-2012 13:44
Alex Akulov
Dear colleaguesI am very interested in the bookArx
26-03-2012 22:54
Björn Wergen
Hi,does anybody have this paper:SHOEMAKER R. A. 19
27-03-2012 22:14
Roland LabbéBonjour !Voici une planche et une photo macro de c
24-03-2012 12:57
Yannick Mourgues
Hi. Macro : apo with a red to dark red hymenium,
26-03-2012 22:52
M Jonathan
J'ai trouvé un Chlorociboria Sp mais je n'arrive
06-03-2012 13:12
Stefan BlaserHello everybody I hope that anyone can help me wi
On dung of Alpaca, I need help with determination
Christiane Baethcke,
17-03-2012 08:52
Hallo everybody,I found this species on alpaca dung. I can´t even find the genus. The size is 0,5-1 mm. The form is like a hairy ball. The asci are round as well, so are the spores. I measured free spores 10-15 µ. There is no reaction of the ascus with lugol. I couldn´t see yet, whether the asci are operculate or not. With the key of Doveri I end up with Ascodesmis, which is much smaller. With Nordic Macromycetes I end up with Trichobolus, which is definitely not right. I didn´t find any parafyses. Two preparations are in water, one in lugol. The macro photograph is taken through the microscope and stacked.
Kind regards
Christiane
Gernot Friebes,
17-03-2012 13:43
Re : Help with determination
Hi Christiane,
I think that your species belongs either to the Onygenaceae or to the Gymnoascaceae (both Onygenales). However, it seems a bit immature to me...
Maybe it would help if you wrote something like "on dung" in the title so the "coprophilous" mycologists won't miss this thread. :)
Best wishes,
Gernot
I think that your species belongs either to the Onygenaceae or to the Gymnoascaceae (both Onygenales). However, it seems a bit immature to me...
Maybe it would help if you wrote something like "on dung" in the title so the "coprophilous" mycologists won't miss this thread. :)
Best wishes,
Gernot
Christiane Baethcke,
17-03-2012 15:52
Re : On dung of Alpaca, I need help with determination
Thanks for the advice, I changed the title
Neven Matocec,
17-03-2012 20:19
Re : On dung of Alpaca, I need help with determination
Dear Christiane,
I preliminary concur with Gernot. Apart from Onygenales I could not think of any other ascomycete group. Though the spores are so delicate, smooth and transparent therefore could not match any genus of the group I had in my hands so far. Indeed, maybe due to younger stage of development.
What you could do is to try to give us more information. The structure of cleistothecial peridium is highly informative. Could you make a section of peridium or at least try to make a squash preparation. Judging from your macrophotograph, the peridium might have some appendages!
Cheers,
Neven
I preliminary concur with Gernot. Apart from Onygenales I could not think of any other ascomycete group. Though the spores are so delicate, smooth and transparent therefore could not match any genus of the group I had in my hands so far. Indeed, maybe due to younger stage of development.
What you could do is to try to give us more information. The structure of cleistothecial peridium is highly informative. Could you make a section of peridium or at least try to make a squash preparation. Judging from your macrophotograph, the peridium might have some appendages!
Cheers,
Neven
Christiane Baethcke,
17-03-2012 22:06
Re : On dung of Alpaca, I need help with determination
There is not much of an appendix or something like it on the peritheum. The most I can make of it can you see here on another macrofoto (stack) are a few hair like fibres, growing to the substrate. The fungus grows as well on the kitchentissue in the wet box. When you cut it, there comes some fluid out. Seems quite mature to me at the moment, I found lots of free spores (kongorood)
Neven Matocec,
18-03-2012 10:18
Re : On dung of Alpaca, I need help with determination
Dear Christiane,
Still don't have idea! My associate and me are kind of interested to apply whole set of cytochemistry test on your fungus but we can't promisse you quick result!
So if you are willing to send us a part (preferably in living/fresh state) of your collection you can turn to my e-mail address (under my link when you access the forum through the registration) and we could then set the details!
Cheers,
Neven
Still don't have idea! My associate and me are kind of interested to apply whole set of cytochemistry test on your fungus but we can't promisse you quick result!
So if you are willing to send us a part (preferably in living/fresh state) of your collection you can turn to my e-mail address (under my link when you access the forum through the registration) and we could then set the details!
Cheers,
Neven
Christiane Baethcke,
18-03-2012 10:48
Re : On dung of Alpaca, I need help with determination
More photos of the peridium
David Malloch,
18-03-2012 17:02
Re : On dung of Alpaca, I need help with determination
Hello Christiane..
Perhaps it is more like a species of Lasiobolidium. The ones I have worked with have clavate to cylidrical asci, but that may not eliminate yours from the genus. Your photograph of the yellow cleistothecia shows some kind of hairs; maybe not as distinct as usual in Lasiobolidium but still there is something like them in your photo. I know that it is not L. orbiculoides or L. spirale, but there are several others listed on Mycobank that might fit.
Dave
Perhaps it is more like a species of Lasiobolidium. The ones I have worked with have clavate to cylidrical asci, but that may not eliminate yours from the genus. Your photograph of the yellow cleistothecia shows some kind of hairs; maybe not as distinct as usual in Lasiobolidium but still there is something like them in your photo. I know that it is not L. orbiculoides or L. spirale, but there are several others listed on Mycobank that might fit.
Dave
Christiane Baethcke,
19-03-2012 09:09
Re : On dung of Alpaca, I need help with determination
Thanks to all of you for your help. Today I sent some material to Neven.
Kind regards
Christiane
Kind regards
Christiane
Neven Matocec,
19-03-2012 11:12
Re : On dung of Alpaca, I need help with determination
Dear Christiane, David, Gernot & others,
Christiane, thank you for your shipment!
I was mainly interested since I felt, chiefly according to spores characters and not clearly evanescent type of asci that the species might have pezizalean affinity (our main interest is not onygenalean fungi)!
Like David already said, Lasiobolidium/Orbicula like organisms may well be most closely guess!
We'll engage all tests we have at our disposal to reveal the true fungus affinity/identity.
Best regards,
Neven
Christiane, thank you for your shipment!
I was mainly interested since I felt, chiefly according to spores characters and not clearly evanescent type of asci that the species might have pezizalean affinity (our main interest is not onygenalean fungi)!
Like David already said, Lasiobolidium/Orbicula like organisms may well be most closely guess!
We'll engage all tests we have at our disposal to reveal the true fungus affinity/identity.
Best regards,
Neven
Lily Barnes,
28-03-2012 15:45
Re : On dung of Alpaca, I need help with determination
Wow this is an interesting thread, thanks for sharing these amazing pictures! Now I can really imagine how all of this has to work. And the tips are also great, I will definitely keep them in mind for the future! I just discovered this forum but I'm really amazed that there are so many interesting postings!
Christiane Baethcke,
28-03-2012 23:15
Re : On dung of Alpaca, I need help with determination
I have nothing heard of Neven yet, except that the collection arrived in very good condition. But I have new pictures from mature spores, indeed befor they were inmmature, as Gernot said. They are now warty. The first photo is stacked.
David Malloch,
29-03-2012 00:11
Re : On dung of Alpaca, I need help with determination
Dear Christiane,
Beautiful pictures! This is not a species of Lasiobolidium, which should have smooth spores. Roumegueriella rufula has spores like this but the ascomata are orange. I hope Neven has something to add to this. Hello Neven, good luck on this interesting fungus! Also, welcome Lily!!
Dave
Beautiful pictures! This is not a species of Lasiobolidium, which should have smooth spores. Roumegueriella rufula has spores like this but the ascomata are orange. I hope Neven has something to add to this. Hello Neven, good luck on this interesting fungus! Also, welcome Lily!!
Dave
Neven Matocec,
29-03-2012 07:19
Re : On dung of Alpaca, I need help with determination
Hi Christiane, hi David,
We are in the middle of work on this strikingly interesting Alpaca dung fungus! As I said before (also in e-mail!) I can't promise quick results on this tough issue.
Anyway, I'm glad that Gernot's and mine feelings about ontogeny when you first post the fungus pics were right!
We are also waiting for funds that should supposedly come in few weeks or a month to our lab(s) when we plan to continue with extended analysis on this. The species surely deserves it!
Cheers,
Neven
We are in the middle of work on this strikingly interesting Alpaca dung fungus! As I said before (also in e-mail!) I can't promise quick results on this tough issue.
Anyway, I'm glad that Gernot's and mine feelings about ontogeny when you first post the fungus pics were right!
We are also waiting for funds that should supposedly come in few weeks or a month to our lab(s) when we plan to continue with extended analysis on this. The species surely deserves it!
Cheers,
Neven
Gernot Friebes,
29-03-2012 10:44
Re : On dung of Alpaca, I need help with determination
Hi everybody,
nice to see that the ascospores matured! Christiane, did they stay completely hyaline or could you observe a change of their colour? On the first of the two new photos it seems that the ascospores are slightly brownish but it may be an artefact of the photo.
I think that the genus Amauroascus might fit for your find but I don't know any species with a comparable spore size. I'm really looking forward to Neven's result!
Best wishes,
Gernot
nice to see that the ascospores matured! Christiane, did they stay completely hyaline or could you observe a change of their colour? On the first of the two new photos it seems that the ascospores are slightly brownish but it may be an artefact of the photo.
I think that the genus Amauroascus might fit for your find but I don't know any species with a comparable spore size. I'm really looking forward to Neven's result!
Best wishes,
Gernot
Martin Bemmann,
29-03-2012 20:17
Re : On dung of Alpaca, I need help with determination
Hi,
unfortunatelly I don't have acces to the fulltext of Doveri et al. (2012) A comparative study of Neogymnomyces virgineus, a new keratinolytic species from dung, and its relationships with the Onygenales, Fungal Diversity 52, 13-34.
Viewing just the thumbnails it reminds me on Christiane's fungus.
Maybe someone can contribute with this paper or check its contents.
best regards
unfortunatelly I don't have acces to the fulltext of Doveri et al. (2012) A comparative study of Neogymnomyces virgineus, a new keratinolytic species from dung, and its relationships with the Onygenales, Fungal Diversity 52, 13-34.
Viewing just the thumbnails it reminds me on Christiane's fungus.
Maybe someone can contribute with this paper or check its contents.
best regards
Martin
Gernot Friebes,
29-03-2012 20:28
Re : On dung of Alpaca, I need help with determination
Hi Martin,
I neither have access to this article but the description of N. virgineus is available on MycoBank. Ascospores are much smaller according to this, also only sperical in front view.
Best wishes,
Gernot
I neither have access to this article but the description of N. virgineus is available on MycoBank. Ascospores are much smaller according to this, also only sperical in front view.
Best wishes,
Gernot
Martin Bemmann,
29-03-2012 20:37
Re : On dung of Alpaca, I need help with determination
Hi Gernot,
yes, these spores are three times smaller... :-(
Orr's work on the genus Neogymnomyces is again in a journal not accessible to me (Canadian Journal of Botany 1970, 48(6): 1061-1066).
Grüße
Martin
yes, these spores are three times smaller... :-(
Orr's work on the genus Neogymnomyces is again in a journal not accessible to me (Canadian Journal of Botany 1970, 48(6): 1061-1066).
Grüße
Martin
Christiane Baethcke,
29-03-2012 20:44
Re : On dung of Alpaca, I need help with determination
I made a new prep and found, that the spores changed colour. Look for your self, they become all light brown. So Gernot, you are right again. The consistence of the fungus changed as well, when it was in beginning really hard to cut even with a sharp blade, I had not to cut at all.
